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absentx

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Posts: 3
Reply with quote  #1 
Hi All,

Just had an E65GNALF (pontoon series) installed on our 29 foot pontoon boat. I believe this to be the right forum as the 65 seems like a de-tuned 75 or 90 inline three cylinder.

Propeller is a 14x9. We took the spring to install a new transom on the boat to better handle today's heavier engines. Initial testing at dealership with a 14x11 had the boat ventilating so bad they couldn't even get past quarter throttle.

Once all the pontoon furniture and equipment was back on the boat, coupled with the switch to the 14x9, the boat performed amazing. Truly impressed with the engine and everything we wanted in trying to re-power a thirty year old pontoon boat.

We ran a NMEA 2000 cable to an HDS-5 to get engine data during our first day out with it.

At WOT we maybe hit 4800 rpm once, but the norm was much more in the 4400 to 4600 range and top speed was 14.5 to 15 mph, which we were very happy with for our barge like pontoon. Obviously those rpm's are anywhere from 200 to 600 off the bottom of the normal WOT range. As far as we can tell, we can't pitch down any further on the prop, and frankly we really like how the nine pitch performs. I think if we found our missing RPM's we might be able to hit 16 or maybe even 17mph.

Any suggestions on possible fixes? Is it easy to mess up throttle cable install? Perhaps we just aren't getting full throttle? We believe outboard height is pretty dialed as we can just see the AV plate at WOT (plus water nicely riding off the smaller upper deflector too) and we stay completely connected in turns. Zero cavitation or ventilation issues.

To be honest we are thrilled with how the boat is performing so I am hesitant to mess with too much, but I would like to get the RPM'S in the zone.

Also - the other question is how many hours should these things come with brand new? I swear I pulled up the engine hours once on the Lowrance and it said 19.4. I could have been looking at the wrong thing and I wont be back with the boat for another week, but between factory testing and dealer lake testing that seems like quite a few. The engine was sold to us as brand new and we even got the eight year extended warranty as part of the sales event that ended June 30th.
PhilH12

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Posts: 3,492
Reply with quote  #2 
Welcome!  That 65 'may' bit a bit light for that sized 'toon?  Almost 50% longer than mine, and my '07 vintage came with a 90, although many around here run 20' 'toons and even 24's with 50 HP's or so.

You do need to get the rpm's up a bit, as you've mentioned.  A ton of info on 'propping' on here, but mostly applies to mono-hulls.  These 'toons are a bit different, IMHO.

My 90 on a 20' 'toon gave 23 mph (gps) as max, but I think I need to raise it a bit, along with the Hi-Flow intakes to see if it'll run a bit better, although no overheating problems.  23 is plenty for this old boy.  Get me fishin' and get me back to the slip when I'm done.  [wink]

19 hours does seem high, for so new a motor?

Phil

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Always check the Easy Stuff First!
20' Weeres fishing pontoon
90 HP E-Tec E90DPLSUM  05184332
Lake Tawakoni, TX - Catfish Capital of Texas
Huey

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Posts: 13,844
Reply with quote  #3 
What is the P/N of the prop you have-is it the Hydrus alloy prop designed for pontoons-P/N 177201? Check to make sure the throttle lever is coning against both its WOT and idle stop on the block when you operate the control box. Fitting the better HE cables would be wise to if not done so already.
absentx

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Posts: 3
Reply with quote  #4 
Phil - The boat originally had a 50hp. That thing was low on compression and thirty years old with a bad prop, so the three cylinder with a bigger gear box and 65 horsies is actually a pretty nice jump for us. The torque with the gear box and nine pitch is really nice!

I think we are a lot like you, we spend 90% of the time fishing where we troll between 1.5 and 3.5 mph. We want speed for escaping storms, cooling down and shooting up the river to some of the bars/taverns.

Hoping I Just had the wrong thing selected for the hours, I'll check that again in a weekend or two when I am with the boat again.

Huey - while I am not with the boat I do not believe it to be the Hydrus and here is why: I know for a fact the prop we received was a 14x9, as I saw the stamp when I was inspecting it, so I think it would be 763300.

I wonder if the Hydrus with the part number you mentioned would be worth a shot?

I'll definitely check the cable against the mentioned stop blocks. What are the better HE cables? Just an upgraded product/design or something?
PhilH12

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Posts: 3,492
Reply with quote  #5 
The Hydrus is pretty high "load" to my knowledge, so it may actually slow down your rpm's?  I've looked but not tried 'em myself, and Certainly not that I'm gonna spend a mint trying for "optimum" speed.  LOL

My rpm was 'right there' at about 5100 on an analog tach, so I "figure" I'm in the ballpark, at least.  Meanwhile, if I can lift the motor a hole or two without overheating, I might give one a go, just for laughs, especially if going up means my rpm's increase over Optimum when hooked to the EV Diag.

Watch out for 'too much' low speed running though.  Carbon fouling, etc.  Open 'er up on each trip, maybe on the way back in, and blow that stuff out.

Puttin' along, singing my song....  [biggrin]

Phil

__________________
Always check the Easy Stuff First!
20' Weeres fishing pontoon
90 HP E-Tec E90DPLSUM  05184332
Lake Tawakoni, TX - Catfish Capital of Texas
Huey

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Posts: 13,844
Reply with quote  #6 
Propping is all trial and error, but you do not have a Hydrus prop unless it is the P/N I indicated and it is a 13 7/8 diameter and designed for pontoon boats. you might find the it does not do what you want but only one way to know for sure and that is to try it. The cables are much better cables-being spoken about on here before.
absentx

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Posts: 3
Reply with quote  #7 
Moved this from the pictures thread on this particular boat that was here, I think more relevant in this forum since its rpm/prop/engine related.

Alright finally got back up to the boat this weekend. Unfortunately we won't be able to get up to the lake again before our required take out date of October 15th so we used the boat on Saturday then took it out of the water and winterized after a few solid hours of fishing and cruising around.

Something has changed!

So when I last reported we were topping out at about 4700 rpm and 14.5 mph. I mistakenly misread the engine hours on the Lowrance as being at twenty back in July, which seemed strange for a new engine. Alas I found the right setting this time and the hours were just hitting 12 when we fired it up Saturday, and that makes about perfect sense. We ran for about four hours the first time we had it out, and two of the other owners have had it out on two occasion for a few hours a piece since we first got it back from the dealer.

I don't know if we have exited the double oil phase or what, but all Saturday we were regularly hitting 16.5 to 17 mph at 5400 to 5500 rpm. In fact a few times she ticked lightly into the very low 5600's. 

I am thrilled we are getting that much speed on a huge boat like this, but now I am almost worried we are getting a few too many rpms! 

Current prop is a 13x9 but I am not even sure if we can find a ten pitch for this boat. Either way I think we are really close now.

Would the break in phase dictate the lower speed and rpm's seen during the first day of use? We were 600 to 700 rpm's higher this weekend.

speed-rpm.jpg 
Huey

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Posts: 13,844
Reply with quote  #8 
No break-in and therefore no limiting of RPM in the first few hours. 5500RPM on a pontoon I could live with due to be on the high side but when full of people and gear the revs might be down to around the ideal 5200RPM. 
rickmcd53

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Posts: 2,492
Reply with quote  #9 
The engine will do a bit better after the double oil cycle which is for the first 5 hours of running time above 2000rpm. Shouldn't have made that big a difference though. Sounds like you are propped correctly now.
I have a 25' flat bottom house boat and have had two 75 Etec's and a pontoon 90 in the last 5 years. On the 75's I ran an 11 pitch with 2 people on board at 5200 rpm. Adding 400 lbs of people and gear would drop it to 4800. The 9 pitch would run 5500 light and 5200 loaded. Speed was 19 with the 9 and 21 with the 11. The pontoon 90 has a 13 pitch, 5400 rpm at 24 mph. I still loose 2 mph and 200 rpm for every 2 people added to the boat.
90 percent of our run time is 5 mph around 1800 rpm. With the 75's I could run 2-6 mph or get on plane and run 14-20. The pontoon 90 has great mid-range torque and I can run at any speed. I think BRP got it right with the pontoon series! We put 1500 hours on the 2011 75 and 400 hours on the 2014? 75. I switched to the E90SLAFC primarily for the softer motor mounts because the 75's would rattle the cabin windows at certain ROM's and I'd have to shut the engine off when shooting pictures with the 1000mm lens on a tripod. The pontoon series is much smoother.
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