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roamer7

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Reply with quote  #1 
It's a 2004 90 that's spent it's entire life on the XD-100 setting running XD-100 oil. I've done tons of trolling with her. I haven't had it hooked up to Ediag recently but it must have around 2000 hours or so on it. Its developed a hard knock that is especially loud after throttling back from cruise and between 1000-2000 RPM. If I run auto-winterize it will quiet down for a bit but then comes back. It does it equally in neutral or in gear. At cruise you don't hear a knock but there is a slight intermittent miss that wasn't there before.

When I run it with the cowling off the knock is loud. Like a ball peen hammer on a block of aluminum. I suspect it's rod knock and that the engine is not long for this world. It came on quick a couple of weeks back and hasn't gotten worse or better. It sounds too loud to be piston slap but it could be I suppose. It's an old motor with lots of hours.

Anyone think of anything less serious I can check for?

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2004 Princecraft Sportfisher Pontoon
2020 DF90A Suzuki replacing 2004 90 HP Evinrude E-Tec E90DPLSRC
Other BRP toys include:
2021 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcountry 600R E-TEC
2015 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcounty 800R E-TEC
2013 Can-Am Outlander Max 800R XT G2 w/ DPS
Evan

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Reply with quote  #2 
Check/Change the lower unit lube.  Sometimes if the lower unit it is damaged the knocking noise will come up through the drive shaft.  Your instincts are probably correct though.
Huey

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Reply with quote  #3 
It is an hour's job to remove the intake and then you can physically see the BE bearings and con-rods. To have it start weeks ago and not get any worse is not what usually happens with any bearing that has failed, they are lucky to last another hour or so. 
steelhead

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Reply with quote  #4 

Do compression tests first, will point you to hole to look for piston slapping.

Then the bottom end per Huey

My guess, plugged injector, lean fuel cyl/piston meltdown.  Old high hr motor

roamer7

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Reply with quote  #5 
My sneaking suspicion is a bad wristpin bearing. When started cold there is very little knock because the bearing is cold and not sticking/jamming the skirt of the piston against the cylinder wall. When running at cruise the bearing heats up and resists movement and the piston slap becomes severe. Running the autofog floods the engine with oil, coating the sleeves and lubing the bad bearing quieting the knock temporarily. The XD-100 setting combined with huge trolling hours likely meant the wristpins got very little lube for extended periods of time. Over the years they wore out and one finally failed. I'm thinking the cage has started to come apart and the needles don't roll freely (binding together). Unlike the big end the wristpins just rock back and forth and that's why it's still running.

I'm thinking a re-power is in order. I may repair the engine and put it on a different boat however. I was hoping for a G2 90 HP but I guess that ship has sailed. I'll be just another guy with a gray engine ;-) .

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2004 Princecraft Sportfisher Pontoon
2020 DF90A Suzuki replacing 2004 90 HP Evinrude E-Tec E90DPLSRC
Other BRP toys include:
2021 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcountry 600R E-TEC
2015 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcounty 800R E-TEC
2013 Can-Am Outlander Max 800R XT G2 w/ DPS
Huey

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Reply with quote  #6 
There is no bearing cage on the LE bearing and have not seen many of these fail at all. Your engine so your call but if it was mine, I would spend around 2 hours to remove the cylinder head, check for follow thru, check the condition of bores and remove the intake to inspect as mentioned earlier. With the intake off you can undo the BE bolts of the cylinder that is making the noise and push the piston/rod assy out to see what it looks like. 
roamer7

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Reply with quote  #7 
I've never seen the bearing in question but the fiche seems to show a split caged bearing for the little end. I will defer to your experience however. I was assuming that repairing the engine would mean a complete powerhead removal and disassemby. Perhaps it's worth an exploratory teardown after all. I'm used to sled engines and have never ripped into an outboard. Would it be possible to change a single piston and both rod bearings (and likely the rod itself) with this method?
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2004 Princecraft Sportfisher Pontoon
2020 DF90A Suzuki replacing 2004 90 HP Evinrude E-Tec E90DPLSRC
Other BRP toys include:
2021 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcountry 600R E-TEC
2015 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcounty 800R E-TEC
2013 Can-Am Outlander Max 800R XT G2 w/ DPS
Huey

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Reply with quote  #8 
I have seen the bearing in question and why I replied like I did. As mentioned if it was me, I would do what I suggested and I have replaced pistons and rod assemblies without splitting the crankcase, not sure of your skill level but can be done. An afternoon work will answer all the questions you have as to what problem is-you did inspect the gear lube and if Ok, find out which cylinder is making the noise and remove that assembly.
roamer7

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Reply with quote  #9 
Thanks. I've rebuilt many a sled engine (just did a complete top and bottom of my 800R E-TEC last winter) but as I said I've never done anything like this on an OB. Still, there's a first time for everything [cool].
__________________
2004 Princecraft Sportfisher Pontoon
2020 DF90A Suzuki replacing 2004 90 HP Evinrude E-Tec E90DPLSRC
Other BRP toys include:
2021 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcountry 600R E-TEC
2015 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcounty 800R E-TEC
2013 Can-Am Outlander Max 800R XT G2 w/ DPS
roamer7

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Reply with quote  #10 
Decided on a re-power. After 16 years it's time. My plan is to pull the powerhead and do a complete rebuild on the E-TEC when I have the time. My bother has a 16' Starcraft that's rated for a 60 HP that should be a rocket with the E-TEC on her [biggrin]
__________________
2004 Princecraft Sportfisher Pontoon
2020 DF90A Suzuki replacing 2004 90 HP Evinrude E-Tec E90DPLSRC
Other BRP toys include:
2021 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcountry 600R E-TEC
2015 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcounty 800R E-TEC
2013 Can-Am Outlander Max 800R XT G2 w/ DPS
Crosbyman

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Reply with quote  #11 
...or  a submarine [frown]
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ETEC 75 HP  2005  ser# 05107924  &  1966  9.5 hp  Sportwin 9622a 
roamer7

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Reply with quote  #12 
I doubt it. There's an old 65 Merc on it now that weighs at least as much as the E-TEC 90. Both are triples to boot. Just being careful on take-off should be all that's required [biggrin]
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2004 Princecraft Sportfisher Pontoon
2020 DF90A Suzuki replacing 2004 90 HP Evinrude E-Tec E90DPLSRC
Other BRP toys include:
2021 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcountry 600R E-TEC
2015 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcounty 800R E-TEC
2013 Can-Am Outlander Max 800R XT G2 w/ DPS
roamer7

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Reply with quote  #13 
Well I decided to re-power with a Suzuki DF90. As a long time BRP guy this was a somewhat painful decision. I was waiting for a G2 90 with pure power combustion but alas that will never come to be now, and I didn't want to buy an orphan engine that I might have trouble finding parts for in the future (I know what BRP's official line is but I don't trust it).

The 'Zuke had the best fuel mileage of the bunch at cruise (significantly better than all the other 4 strokes and the E-Tec as well) and was cheaper than most (except for Honda), so that's what I went with.

I'm only 4 hours into the 10 hour break-in but I noticed a few things. The Suzuki is almost silent at idle and when trolling, but is actually a bit louder than the E-TEC at cruise. The Suzuki will run a 13 pitch prop hitting it's max 6000 RPM, whereas the E-TEC would only swing an 11 pitch hitting it's 5200 RPM max RPM. Low and mid-range torque feel similar on both motors but I have a feeling if I let the Suzuki wind out it's top end will be a smidge higher than the Evinrude. I'll find out after the 10 hour break-in is over I suppose.

I'll miss the low maintenance aspect of the E-TEC the most. I liked to just put the boat in the lake in the spring and pull it out in the fall and not to need any in-season maintenance. 100 hour oil changes will have me pulling the boat out of the water for an oil change mid-season. 

BRP IMO made a huge mistake. They were the last man standing in the 2 stroke outboard arena. I know up here the in-lines were extremely popular, especially on smaller and older boats designed for 2 strokes.

Too bad, so sad, life goes on [smile] . 

__________________
2004 Princecraft Sportfisher Pontoon
2020 DF90A Suzuki replacing 2004 90 HP Evinrude E-Tec E90DPLSRC
Other BRP toys include:
2021 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcountry 600R E-TEC
2015 Ski-Doo Renegade Backcounty 800R E-TEC
2013 Can-Am Outlander Max 800R XT G2 w/ DPS
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